Comments on: Harvard study finds nearly 45,000 excess deaths annually linked to lack of health coverage http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/ Organizing for a national, single-payer healthcare system. Sat, 11 Feb 2012 03:00:52 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Marcia http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-7640 Marcia Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:07:22 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-7640 "Why is it that most U.S. doctors and nurses support either a single payer system or a system with a public option?" Answer: They dont. Thats a complete falsehood. Most are against that. "If we would get out of Iraq and Afghanistan and repeal the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy we would have the money for a single payer system." No we wouldnt. The Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan cost somewhere around 60-80 billion dollars a year. Thats not nearly enough to run a single payer system. Plus if we pulled out of Iraq and Afghanistan, you'd find that the costs wouldnt come down much because the vast majority of those funds go to our troops. So if we pulled them out of Iraq and Afghanistan, whether we send them home to the United States and/or put them in other countries, we still would have to pay that expense. And the bush tax cuts are not for the wealthy alone. They applied to middle class and poor people too. Whats more a tax cut doesnt cost us anything. Its not an expenditure like the wars. When you give people a tax cut, youre not giving them anything out of governments pocket. You are simply letting them keep more of what they earn. Besides which, those tax cuts will expire (or rather have expired) “Why is it that most U.S. doctors and nurses support either a single payer system or a system with a public option?”

Answer: They dont. Thats a complete falsehood. Most are against that.

“If we would get out of Iraq and Afghanistan and repeal the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy we would have the money for a single payer system.”

No we wouldnt. The Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan cost somewhere around 60-80 billion dollars a year. Thats not nearly enough to run a single payer system. Plus if we pulled out of Iraq and Afghanistan, you’d find that the costs wouldnt come down much because the vast majority of those funds go to our troops. So if we pulled them out of Iraq and Afghanistan, whether we send them home to the United States and/or put them in other countries, we still would have to pay that expense.

And the bush tax cuts are not for the wealthy alone. They applied to middle class and poor people too. Whats more a tax cut doesnt cost us anything. Its not an expenditure like the wars. When you give people a tax cut, youre not giving them anything out of governments pocket. You are simply letting them keep more of what they earn. Besides which, those tax cuts will expire (or rather have expired)

]]> By: John Lloyd Scharf http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-5277 John Lloyd Scharf Thu, 05 Nov 2009 16:29:03 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-5277 If health care is the problem, insurance is not the cause and government is not the answer. . Of those "50 million," that lack insurance there were 45,000 who died without health care. . WITH health care, 98,000 died FROM health care because of malpractice. . The question is do we want to trust that largest corporation in the world, the U.S. Government. Do not expect house calls anytime soon. . We have seen how well the government delivers on its promises and its bureaucracies pursue the money without giving us benefits on so many levels. . Imagine another 111 bureacracies that only ultimately must listen to the Secretary of the Treasury - another "service" of which is the IRS. . http://theprogressivecapitalist.blogspot.com/2009/10/affordable-health-care-for-america-act.html . That blog of mine above has several .pdf connections (HR. 3962 and two summaries, a few videos, and page references for new taxes and other mandates). . If you cannot use the link, google "Progressive Capitalist H.R. 3962." . If you believe the promises of this bill, you have to deal with the lie that it fosters competition with a government option called the "Public Option" and establishes the government as a monopoly making its own rules. Don't worry. You'll run out of "rich" soon enough. . We have at least a $12 trillion economy of which at least $1.8 trillion is spent on health care. . If you read the bill, there are plenty of opportunities to soak the middle class, if you do not mind the 1.6 million made jobless. . REPUBLICAN Affordable Health Care For America Act . MAKING HEALTH Care Affordable For EVERY AmeriCAN . http://docs.house.gov/rules/health/111_hr3962_boehner_sub.pdf If health care is the problem, insurance is not the cause and government is not the answer.
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Of those “50 million,” that lack insurance there were 45,000 who died without health care.
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WITH health care, 98,000 died FROM health care because of malpractice.
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The question is do we want to trust that largest corporation in the world, the U.S. Government. Do not expect house calls anytime soon.
.
We have seen how well the government delivers on its promises and its bureaucracies pursue the money without giving us benefits on so many levels.
.
Imagine another 111 bureacracies that only ultimately must listen to the Secretary of the Treasury – another “service” of which is the IRS.
.
http://theprogressivecapitalist.blogspot.com/2009/10/affordable-health-care-for-america-act.html
.
That blog of mine above has several .pdf connections (HR. 3962 and two summaries, a few videos, and page references for new taxes and other mandates).
.
If you cannot use the link, google “Progressive Capitalist H.R. 3962.”
.
If you believe the promises of this bill, you have to deal with the lie that it fosters competition with a government option called the “Public Option” and establishes the government as a monopoly making its own rules. Don’t worry. You’ll run out of “rich” soon enough.
.
We have at least a $12 trillion economy of which at least $1.8 trillion is spent on health care.
.
If you read the bill, there are plenty of opportunities to soak the middle class, if you do not mind the 1.6 million made jobless.
.
REPUBLICAN Affordable Health Care For America Act
.
MAKING HEALTH Care Affordable For EVERY AmeriCAN
.
http://docs.house.gov/rules/health/111_hr3962_boehner_sub.pdf

]]> By: kc http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-5255 kc Sat, 31 Oct 2009 22:30:14 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-5255 People die with or without health insurance. Lack of insurance does not equate to lack of healthcare. People in this country seem to be brainwashed. Every person without regard to ability to pay can and do get free healthcare through the emergency rooms and free clinics which allbeit not as nice as private, but nevertheless free. The poor qualify for medicaid. There are 15 million uninsured who make over 57,000 dollars per year and could afford health insurance but choose not to. 12 million are illegal aliens. Very few actually fall in the hole between being eligible for medicaid and truly not make enough money to afford insurance (although they have a car, cell phone, and an ipod). We can easily expand medicaid to make those eligible. That in combination with allowing health insurance companies to compete across state lines, and tort reform (3-5% total savings on healthcare) would solve our problems without trying to "fix" the entire system. People die with or without health insurance. Lack of insurance does not equate to lack of healthcare. People in this country seem to be brainwashed. Every person without regard to ability to pay can and do get free healthcare through the emergency rooms and free clinics which allbeit not as nice as private, but nevertheless free. The poor qualify for medicaid. There are 15 million uninsured who make over 57,000 dollars per year and could afford health insurance but choose not to. 12 million are illegal aliens. Very few actually fall in the hole between being eligible for medicaid and truly not make enough money to afford insurance (although they have a car, cell phone, and an ipod). We can easily expand medicaid to make those eligible. That in combination with allowing health insurance companies to compete across state lines, and tort reform (3-5% total savings on healthcare) would solve our problems without trying to “fix” the entire system.

]]> By: BARB BF http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-5076 BARB BF Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:34:39 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-5076 http://drivethrupolitics.blogspot.com/2009/06/medical-errors-kill-over-100000-every.html In 1999, a report by the Institute of Medicine (IOM) claimed that nearly 98,000 people die each year as a result of completely preventable medical errors. Ten years later, things have only gotten worse. The latest report by the Consumers Union claims that medical errors are causing more preventable deaths than ever -- over 100,000 each year. That makes over a million preventable deaths in the last 10 years. These types of gruesome statistics aren't the least bit surprising. The huge, impersonal health care system is capable of swallowing patients whole and losing them in an increasingly vast shuffle. The worst part about this whole thing is that these medical errors are usually not the grandiose kinds that make the headlines, such as surgeons removing or transplanting the wrong organs. It's easily preventable things like wrong prescriptions, improper dosages, and poorly administered treatments. Not long ago, I wrote about a study published in the medical journal Quality and Safety in Health Care that detailed deadly medical errors that occurred in doctor's offices -- before patients even made it to the hospital! The study showed that 82 percent of the errors were caused by so-called "system malfunctions." One patient died because a message was not delivered on time. As disturbing as this is, I shudder to think about how much worse they're likely to get when the health care system is hijacked by Obama's bureaucrats. Try to name just one thing that's run better after it's been taking over by a government bureaucracy. Besides, the Obama Administration has bungled the takeover of the U.S. auto industry. Why should we trust them to do any better with health care? http://drivethrupolitics.blogspot.com/2009/06/medical-errors-kill-over-100000-every.html

In 1999, a report by the Institute of Medicine (IOM) claimed that nearly 98,000 people die each year as a result of completely preventable medical errors. Ten years later, things have only gotten worse. The latest report by the Consumers Union claims that medical errors are causing more preventable deaths than ever — over 100,000 each year.

That makes over a million preventable deaths in the last 10 years.

These types of gruesome statistics aren’t the least bit surprising. The huge, impersonal health care system is capable of swallowing patients whole and losing them in an increasingly vast shuffle.

The worst part about this whole thing is that these medical errors are usually not the grandiose kinds that make the headlines, such as surgeons removing or transplanting the wrong organs. It’s easily preventable things like wrong prescriptions, improper dosages, and poorly administered treatments.

Not long ago, I wrote about a study published in the medical journal Quality and Safety in Health Care that detailed deadly medical errors that occurred in doctor’s offices — before patients even made it to the hospital! The study showed that 82 percent of the errors were caused by so-called “system malfunctions.” One patient died because a message was not delivered on time.

As disturbing as this is, I shudder to think about how much worse they’re likely to get when the health care system is hijacked by Obama’s bureaucrats.

Try to name just one thing that’s run better after it’s been taking over by a government bureaucracy.

Besides, the Obama Administration has bungled the takeover of the U.S. auto industry. Why should we trust them to do any better with health care?

]]> By: george http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-4925 george Fri, 25 Sep 2009 23:25:57 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-4925 The insurance companies are the REAL leeches on the backs of society. They get paid billions a year just for taking our money and passing it to the health care providers. They are useless middlemen, who do NOTHING for our health. Their CEO's are paid tens of millions a year. Health care has risen 3-4X the rate of wage increases. Much faster than the inflation rate. It causes more bankruptcies than anything else. We pay around twice what other countries pay per capita, yet we have poor quality and outcomes. WHO ranks U.S. # 37 in quality. France is #1 andhas national health care. It is ILLEGAL for insurance companies to make a profit off of health care in EVERY other industrialized nation. We pay taxes for our socialist Fire Dept. to put out our house. Isn't our body more important than our house? We should "promote the general welfare" as the Constitution prescribes. We are entitled to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."How can we have life if we have a deadly illness, but can't afford to see a doctor? Government works if we MAKE it work. Wake up and join the 21st century, and stop living in the stone age of health care. We don't even HAVE a health care system in the U.S. All we have is a health insurance racket system, who gets paid to deny us health care. The insurance companies are the REAL leeches on the backs of society. They get paid billions a year just for taking our money and passing it to the health care providers. They are useless middlemen, who do NOTHING for our health. Their CEO’s are paid tens of millions a year. Health care has risen 3-4X the rate of wage increases. Much faster than the inflation rate. It causes more bankruptcies than anything else. We pay around twice what other countries pay per capita, yet we have poor quality and outcomes. WHO ranks U.S. # 37 in quality. France is #1 andhas national health care. It is ILLEGAL for insurance companies to make a profit off of health care in EVERY other industrialized nation. We pay taxes for our socialist Fire Dept. to put out our house. Isn’t our body more important than our house? We should “promote the general welfare” as the Constitution prescribes. We are entitled to “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.”How can we have life if we have a deadly illness, but can’t afford to see a doctor? Government works if we MAKE it work. Wake up and join the 21st century, and stop living in the stone age of health care. We don’t even HAVE a health care system in the U.S. All we have is a health insurance racket system, who gets paid to deny us health care.

]]> By: roberta http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-4906 roberta Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:33:24 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-4906 People are very selective about what they call 'socialism.' I remember Michael Moore's TV Nation show back in the 90s in which he interviewed (selectively of course) citizens of Newt Gingrich's home Cobb County and huge amounts of people wanted 'the government off their backs' and "no taxes' --Moore pointed out that their reservoirs of drinking water, highways, etc, were the result of the government and their taxes and such. These folks sounded exactly like the 'no socialism' ones at the big Fox media event in DC last weekend. Now I saw on the news this morning that there is massive flood damage, much of it in Cobb County. How many of them are going to turn down federal aid for all the damage that their insurance companies are going to bail out on? Too many Americans only seem to care about their own immediate family needs being met. As for anyone else who may have had misfortune or made poor choices (who among us has not at some time?), they are cold-hearted and selfish and cruel and proud to express this. Empathy for our fellow human beings is denigrated as 'liberal social justice'. What happened to our country? People are very selective about what they call ‘socialism.’ I remember Michael Moore’s TV Nation show back in the 90s in which he interviewed (selectively of course) citizens of Newt Gingrich’s home Cobb County and huge amounts of people wanted ‘the government off their backs’ and “no taxes’ –Moore pointed out that their reservoirs of drinking water, highways, etc, were the result of the government and their taxes and such. These folks sounded exactly like the ‘no socialism’ ones at the big Fox media event in DC last weekend. Now I saw on the news this morning that there is massive flood damage, much of it in Cobb County. How many of them are going to turn down federal aid for all the damage that their insurance companies are going to bail out on?

Too many Americans only seem to care about their own immediate family needs being met. As for anyone else who may have had misfortune or made poor choices (who among us has not at some time?), they are cold-hearted and selfish and cruel and proud to express this. Empathy for our fellow human beings is denigrated as ‘liberal social justice’. What happened to our country?

]]> By: DBarr http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-4905 DBarr Wed, 23 Sep 2009 15:44:11 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-4905 Re the comment about the "lazy": There are a number of code words that should always put the reader on alert. "Lazy" in the lexicon of the right means "colored person who will not work for as little as I would like him/her to." In every case, when dealing with the right, attitudes can be traced back to the Confederate States Of America. Of course, the way to immediately convert a neo-confederate is to deny him or her their piece of socialism; listen to them howl if their roads don't get built or their electricity goes out. Or if some clerk at city hall doesn't get back to them on a complaint fast enough. They do not understand democracy, and there is a question whether they want or even like it. Remember, this is the side that prefers to shoot leaders than allow the slow, annoying process of the vote to work; remember the Kennedys and King, and the Tea-Baggers bringing guns to health-care rallies. Re the comment about the “lazy”: There are a number of code words that should always put the reader on alert. “Lazy” in the lexicon of the right means “colored person who will not work for as little as I would like him/her to.” In every case, when dealing with the right, attitudes can be traced back to the Confederate States Of America.

Of course, the way to immediately convert a neo-confederate is to deny him or her their piece of socialism; listen to them howl if their roads don’t get built or their electricity goes out. Or if some clerk at city hall doesn’t get back to them on a complaint fast enough.

They do not understand democracy, and there is a question whether they want or even like it. Remember, this is the side that prefers to shoot leaders than allow the slow, annoying process of the vote to work; remember the Kennedys and King, and the Tea-Baggers bringing guns to health-care rallies.

]]> By: Chuck Infantino http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-4903 Chuck Infantino Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:32:00 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-4903 The statistic you site for a 10 month wait for cancer treatment was taken in October 1997. It is not current. The Canadians and Europeans I talk to say they are happy with their health care systems. Their may be isolated problems, but they don't have to worry about being financially wiped out if they get a serious illness. They would never trade what they have with what we have, which is a for profit health care system that benefits insurance and pharmaceutical companies. Why is it that most U.S. doctors and nurses support either a single payer system or a system with a public option? It is because they know the problems with our for profit health care system up close and personal. They are getting tired of fighting with insurance companies for approval of treatment or for payment of services. If we would get out of Iraq and Afghanistan and repeal the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy we would have the money for a single payer system. Too many senators and representatives are in the pockets of the for profit health care industry. What we have in this country is a "government of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations". Our founding fathers would roll over in their graves if they knew what was going on. Let me refer you to a quote from Thomas Jefferson in 1800: " I pledge eternal hostility against every form of tyranny of man". He was referring to tyranny in our own country as well the rest of the world. Wake up America! The statistic you site for a 10 month wait for cancer treatment was taken in October 1997. It is not current. The Canadians and Europeans I talk to say they are happy with their health care systems. Their may be isolated problems, but they don’t have to worry about being financially wiped out if they get a serious illness. They would never trade what they have with what we have, which is a for profit health care system that benefits insurance and pharmaceutical companies. Why is it that most U.S. doctors and nurses support either a single payer system or a system with a public option? It is because they know the problems with our for profit health care system up close and personal. They are getting tired of fighting with insurance companies for approval of treatment or for payment of services. If we would get out of Iraq and Afghanistan and repeal the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy we would have the money for a single payer system. Too many senators and representatives are in the pockets of the for profit health care industry. What we have in this country is a “government of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations”. Our founding fathers would roll over in their graves if they knew what was going on. Let me refer you to a quote from Thomas Jefferson in 1800: ” I pledge eternal hostility against every form of tyranny of man”. He was referring to tyranny in our own country as well the rest of the world. Wake up America!

]]> By: Marcia http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-4901 Marcia Tue, 22 Sep 2009 17:45:31 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-4901 "A study published online today estimates nearly 45,000 annual deaths are associated with lack of health insurance." This study is as phony as a 3 dollar bill. No one dies from lack of health insurance. Hey, people still die with health insurance too. Eric B Ross writes: "I’ve lived in Great Britain for 12 years and have direct, personal experience of that country’s National Health Service. It is a civilized way for a developed society to deal with the health needs of its people, regardless of their age, gender or income. No one ever has to worry about being denied essential treatment because they cannot afford it." Really? "A U.K. grandmother has been waiting 13 years for a hip replacement" http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=161366&command=displayContent&sourceNode=161855&contentPK=14055165&folderPk=88503 a 4-year-old girl with several absessed teeth has been waiting in agony over a month for "urgent" dental care: http://www.leedstoday.net/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=39&ArticleID=1349493 10-month wait for cancer treatment http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/675968.stm Cancer patients 'wait too long' http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/uk_news/scotland/4377583.stm Grandmother dies after NHS cancer treatment is withdrawn because she paid privately for life-extending drug http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1016262/Grandmother-dies-NHS-cancer-treatment-withdrawn-paid-privately-life-extending-drug.html Hospital says sorry for grandmother's fatal wait. http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-65294977.html Those are just a few of thousands upon thousands of examples from the UK. Is it "civilized" to make a grandmother wait 13 years for a hip replacement? (In the United states, thats practically unheard of, even for the uninsured). Is it "civilized" make a 4 year old girl wait over a month for much needed emergency dental care? Or is it "civilized" to make people wait many months to get cancer treatment (which has caused people to die as cancers dont wait to spread. They need to be treated as soon as possible, and for many, a 10 month wait can be fatal), or cut off treatment completely because one seeks to supplement their treatment out of their own pocket? “A study published online today estimates nearly 45,000 annual deaths are associated with lack of health insurance.”

This study is as phony as a 3 dollar bill. No one dies from lack of health insurance. Hey, people still die with health insurance too.

Eric B Ross writes: “I’ve lived in Great Britain for 12 years and have direct, personal experience of that country’s National Health Service. It is a civilized way for a developed society to deal with the health needs of its people, regardless of their age, gender or income. No one ever has to worry about being denied essential treatment because they cannot afford it.”

Really?

“A U.K. grandmother has been waiting 13 years for a hip replacement”

http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=161366&command=displayContent&sourceNode=161855&contentPK=14055165&folderPk=88503

a 4-year-old girl with several absessed teeth has been waiting in agony over a month for “urgent” dental care:

http://www.leedstoday.net/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=39&ArticleID=1349493

10-month wait for cancer treatment

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/675968.stm

Cancer patients ‘wait too long’

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/uk_news/scotland/4377583.stm

Grandmother dies after NHS cancer treatment is withdrawn because she paid privately for life-extending drug

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1016262/Grandmother-dies-NHS-cancer-treatment-withdrawn-paid-privately-life-extending-drug.html

Hospital says sorry for grandmother’s fatal wait.

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-65294977.html

Those are just a few of thousands upon thousands of examples from the UK. Is it “civilized” to make a grandmother wait 13 years for a hip replacement? (In the United states, thats practically unheard of, even for the uninsured). Is it “civilized” make a 4 year old girl wait over a month for much needed emergency dental care? Or is it “civilized” to make people wait many months to get cancer treatment (which has caused people to die as cancers dont wait to spread. They need to be treated as soon as possible, and for many, a 10 month wait can be fatal), or cut off treatment completely because one seeks to supplement their treatment out of their own pocket?

]]> By: Nick Lento http://www.healthcare-now.org/harvard-study-finds-nearly-45000-excess-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/comment-page-1/#comment-4894 Nick Lento Mon, 21 Sep 2009 21:53:38 +0000 http://www.healthcare-now.org/?p=2778#comment-4894 Dear "RW" The study was conducted by folks with national reputations and first rate credentials. Have you read it? Which facts, specifically, do you disagree with, and why? Who are you? What are your credentials? RW, your "critique" comes off as the same old intellectually bankrupt non-sense that we get form Glen Beck and the rest of the rabid wretches who irrationally oppose real health care reform. Unless you're willing to have us become a society that simply allows all of the poor and sick to simply die on the street....it's actually far more expensive to let them get sick to the point of dying and then have the poor sick suffering folks show up, or be brought to, an ER where they are admitted and receive critical care until they die. Bottom Line: Single payer would actually be CHEAPER, much much cheaper, in the long run. In other words, RW doing the morally righteous thing and the most financially sound thing are mutually inextricable and reinforcing in this case. The ONLY remotely reasonable "rationale" for keeping the status quo comes from the insurance industry for reasons that are 100% $elf $erving. For everyone else, the truth is clear. Single Payer is the best solution to the existing health care problem. Dear “RW”

The study was conducted by folks with national reputations and first rate credentials. Have you read it?

Which facts, specifically, do you disagree with, and why?

Who are you?

What are your credentials?

RW, your “critique” comes off as the same old intellectually bankrupt non-sense that we get form Glen Beck and the rest of the rabid wretches who irrationally oppose real health care reform.

Unless you’re willing to have us become a society that simply allows all of the poor and sick to simply die on the street….it’s actually far more expensive to let them get sick to the point of dying and then have the poor sick suffering folks show up, or be brought to, an ER where they are admitted and receive critical care until they die.

Bottom Line: Single payer would actually be CHEAPER, much much cheaper, in the long run.

In other words, RW doing the morally righteous thing and the most financially sound thing are mutually inextricable and reinforcing in this case.

The ONLY remotely reasonable “rationale” for keeping the status quo comes from the insurance industry for reasons that are 100% $elf $erving. For everyone else, the truth is clear. Single Payer is the best solution to the existing health care problem.

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